[ Wiktionary for *metipsimus :] Etymology

[0.] From -met (emphatic suffix) + ipse (“himself”) + -issimus (superlative suffix).


*metipsimus (feminine *metipsima, neuter *metipsimum); first/second declension

  1. (Vulgar Latin) same

What semantic notions underlie 0 and 1 above? How did 0 semantically shift to 1? I.e., how does compounding 'himself' with 1 emphatic and 1 superlative suffix generate the meaning of 'same'?

  • 6
    Doesn't the leading * mean that the word is unattested?
    – Rafael
    Aug 10, 2017 at 20:47
  • @Rafael Yes, but the unattested adjective shouldn't affect this question's soundness because it did generate attested cognates.
    – user37
    Nov 2, 2017 at 9:09
  • 2
    @Rafael spot on! Because the question is really about the etymology of French même, which would be considered off-topic here.
    – Alex B.
    Jul 4, 2019 at 0:13

3 Answers 3


The key to the meaning is ipse; all the rest is just intensifiers glommed onto that.

In Classical Latin, ipse meant "self"—not as a reflexive, but as an intensive:

Barack Obaman ipsum apud tabernam vīdī!
I saw Barack Obama himself at the store!

This eventually took on a meaning of "same":

Barack Obaman vīdistī? Praesidentem emeritum?
You saw Barack Obama? The former President?
Ita, Obaman ipsum!
Yes, the very same Obama!

The implication, of course, being "the very same person that you're talking about".

But in Vulgar Latin, ipse weakened over time. The Latin demonstratives were worn away until their force was lost and they became nothing but articles; ipse then lost its intensity and became a normal demonstrative. We see it now in forms like Spanish ése, "that".

So when speakers wanted the actual "same" meaning, they had to bring back the intensity. Sometimes they added superlative endings, as in Petronius's ipsimus; other times they added the intensive -met suffix onto the beginning, from rebracketing tēmet ipse "you, you yourself" as *tē metipse. Eventually they had to combine both to get the proper intensity back, ending up with *metipsimus.

This is the form that survived into Romance, giving us words like Italian medesimo and French même < meïsme, which can either mean "same" or be a raw intensifier ("very" or "even").


Like Draconis stated, it's the weakening of the original word that caused it to be a demonstrative to fill the void that ille and iste left. It's similar to what happened in our language, "the" was originally a demonstrative as well in Old English, but weakened to merely a definite article totally in Middle English.

I believe the addition of the meaning "same" was the result of īdem falling out of favor in colloquial speech, so metipsimus filled that void as well. In Spanish, "mismo", it's cognate, can be used to mean both.

  • Welcome to the site and thank you for the nice answer!
    – Joonas Ilmavirta
    Nov 9, 2019 at 12:43

The Vulgar Latin metipsimus, as a contraction of older metipsissimus, a superlative of metipse, comes from a reanalysis of egomet ipse "me myself" as ego metipse. In Latin, -met was attached to pronouns, but in Vulgar Latin it was reanalyzed as part of ipse instead.

Your Answer

By clicking “Post Your Answer”, you agree to our terms of service and acknowledge you have read our privacy policy.